Top Dog

[wfarid]

NVENTIV has their flagship phasge change cooler the Mach II GT and so does Astek, VAPOCHILL XE... So which one is the top dog?

[Player0]

The VapoChill LS is supposed to take on the MachII, but I hear theres a MachIII coming out.

[Kill-Switch]

Yeah the Vapochill LS is te competition for te Mach II GT. Apparently, from all the BS floating around, as always the nVentiv is the more powerful system beating the Vapochill bya small margin. The fact that this small margin doesn't give much of an increase in o/cing means nothing to the fanboys.

Either way it would appear both the GT and the LS look the same. I mean they look almost identical!! The LS has some ventilation holes down the sides and the Vapochill logo on the front ... if it weren't for that you'd think both were the same system.

I personally like Vapochills ease of installation ... well it's easier than the nVentiv that's for sure LOL Goingto get an LS for my next system ... unless another one comes out before then :D

[wfarid]

there's a vapochill pe for sale right now for approx 340 usd... although u would still need to buy the replacement kit, and the criticool v2.0, its not bad... i think ill probably be buying mine from ebay...

[Kill-Switch]

$340 is not too bad, the replacement head-kit isn't too costly either. And don't you mean ChillControl v2.0 :) I find that strange as te Vapochill PE comes with ChillControl v2.0 as standard.

[illmatik]

I got the vapo cpu kits off ebay for $7, months even b4 I found a cheap enough unit ;)

keep an eye open, you'll prolly find one sooner or later.

[wfarid]

sorry chillcontrol is what i meant, and i said that one would still have to BUY the 478 replacement kit and upgrade the current chillcontrol to the chillcontrol v2.0

[Kill-Switch]

Originally posted by wfarid
... and upgrade the current chillcontrol to the chillcontrol v2.0

I would stay away from it. As I said the Vapochill PE comes with ChillControl v2.0 as standard ... meaning you DON'T have to go out and buy it because you already have it. If this system does not have the CC v2.0 then it's either not a PE and is actually an SE, or the guy damaged the original CC unit andreplaced it with an inferior unit.

[wfarid]

ooh i just thought PE didnt come with chillcontrol v2.0, and the user didnt specify what version of chillcontrol he had in there...

[Kill-Switch]

Well if you're interested in buying it you should make sure it has the CC v2.0 and that there's no damage to the neoprene and hosing. Get pictures so you can see for yourself.

[wfarid]

unfortunately i dont have the cash for it right now... i will after i buy a phase change after i buy a bluetoom keyboard and mouse from logitech and the logitech z-680s... so phase change is a couple of months down the road

[mdzcpa]

I think the LS and GT will be close enough in performance that it won't matter. It will come down to price, quality, and customer service. Either way, we, the consumers, win:)

That said, I am glad both the LS and GT will be moving to 404a based systems. They may not get much colder than the 134 systems, but they will be able to maintain lower temps under long term load (the real measure of quality phase change cooling).

BTW, keep your eyes open. If all goes well, we should be seeing some great phase change product reviews right here an LN. I promise them to be unbiased and very informative.

[wfarid]

cool cool... heh pun...

[Kill-Switch]

All reports say, as always, the GT is more expensive than the LS ... by how much I don't know, but going on nVentivs track record you can assume it will be a fair bit more.

Also the LS uses 507 gas (It's five hundred and something LOL).

[illmatik]

I think for modders, the prommy will leave more room for expansion (507 recharge). I wonder if asetek redesigned their evaporator design. It seems from my reading, the prommy's evap has a larger surface area, but condensation management seems easier on the vapo.

My vapo is about to undergo a 507 conversion (oil, coolant, filter, cap tube, and gas change), which should score me almost 30 degrees w/ much better load handling than R134. When it's all said and done, this is going to have cost me less than $600 (vapo and mods) and be close to (if not better than) mach II performance.

I think for instant gratification, these two new units are top notch although better deals can be had. For those tweakers out there seeking the best performance on a budget (and willing to void warantees), I think the best deal out there is the Mach I modded for and gassed to 507 is the best deal around. It'll run you about $750 factoring a brand new mach I and even include the enlight case.

[wfarid]

how would one go about with converting their prommie or vapo?

[illmatik]

There are a number of things involved in doing this, and will most certainly require the assistance of an HVAC technician since you need to properly reclaim the refrigerant (even though the amounts in there typically factor into allowed bleedoff when servicing larger systems). Don't wan't to upset the environmentalists and the planet now do you? ;) Furthermore, you can't just walk into a store and buy a canister of R404 or R507(need a license) nor would you want to (20kg of 404 is around $500, you only need about 60-70 grams).

"Fill" and "bleed" valves will need to be installed to evacuate the system of all of the R134 refrigerant. All of these units are filled and crimped to comply w/ various EU and US environmental laws so that it's not easy to let these gasses escape into the environment. There are self tapping valves that can be installed, but most techs will professionaly braze/solder them on once the system is evacuated.

From there, most prometeias can be gassed right up with 404 and tuned(gas added + bled) for optimal temp 'loaded' (heat source against evap). Most vapochills will need newer and longer capillary tubing installed to allow the compresser to deal with the higher pressure that the 404 will put on the system (and will shorten compressors lifespan considerably). The vapo will need additional cooling on the compressor electronics as you will be forcing the compressor to work 100% speed 100% of the time.

An R507 charge will require much more work and more precise tuning. In most of these systems the system will need to be completely evacuated, and compressor oil and filter(which separates oil from refrigerant) changed (I think 507 requires esther oil instead of POE). It wall also require longer cap tubing with larger inner diameter before it's charged and tuned.

There's probably a good deal more I'm forgetting, but it's been a long, crazy day. It should be enough of a primer to understand what needs to be done. If you're considering doing any of these mods, I can give you more details, and might even have one or two places to bring them to for this job if you're in the NY/NJ/PA area. I'm currently working out a deal w/ what I think are some good HVAC places w/ competent techs and will hopefully be offering the full gamut of mods for various systems (and hopefully even custom made turnkey autocascades featuring baker gpu and cpu blocks) sometime this summer. If only I can get more days where I can get out of the office before 7PM :(

[wfarid]

what does HVAC stand for, and what does a HVAC technition do?

[illmatik]

Heating Ventilation Air Conditioning

Typically shops that repair and do maintenance on airconditioning systems. I've found that many commercial techs dont seem up to the job, or at least give me enough confidence to trust my phase change system in their hands so far. Out of the licensed shops I've spoken to in the nyc area, I've found companies that specialize in refrigeration seem to be more experienced in systems that require a critical (precise) charge. If you're in Edison, I think you may be in luck. I'm pretty sure the company that does all of the maintenance work for the labs equipment where my dad works is based there. Danfoss compressors (the most common in our beloved cooling units) are quite common in lab refrigeration and laser chilling systems.

[wfarid]

if you are referring to Fridgadare, I think I am out of luck because Fridgadare has outsourced its labor and closed down its Edison plant :eek: So yea no biggie for now, phase change is still a couple of months down the road for me for now... But i'm still interested in knowing more about this process and what not

[illmatik]

I've been learning from a combination of sources, my neighbor who works on heavy duty liebert and canital computer room systems, the 'bowman's mod shop' thread on Xtreme, and

this book (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1930044062/qid=1080227529/sr=1-5/ref=sr_1_5/102-1173081-6472100?v=glance&s=books)

[wfarid]

how much would it cost if i just wanted to get the 507 recharge?

[illmatik]

R507 Recharge on which system?

[wfarid]

i might be getting a compressor from a mini fridge and i wanna recharge it with 507

[dicki]

your best bet is to find out whats in the system allready and look for a better performing compatible refrigerant because as i mentioned somewhere else the coolant you choose depends on the power and design of your compressor. you could also check the part number of the compressor on the manufacturers website

dicki

[illmatik]

It's going to be difficult to estimate pricing on something like that. Compressor type and size, coolant capacity, Evaporator type, cap tube length, existing refirgerant and filter will play into what and how much of what refrigerant can be put into this system.