Case Badge [Archive] - LiquidNinjas.com

Player0

07-12-2002, 05:30 PM

Lee, I don't have that font hand right now. Also, I'm not 100% happy with the current logo. So Im trying new fonts, styles, etc. I think I'll probably try to keep the colors the same though.

I will most likely be redoing the LN header soon, so everything will still match stylistically. Also, Gabe will be working on some more design ideas himself. Whatever design ideas we come up with, we will definately incorporate in to the rest of the site graphics.

With that said, if anyone wants to take a crack at some graphics, go for it. Even if we dont use the logo, it might give us some design ideas for the site. What ever logo goes on the case badge though will be around for a while for sure...im orderign 100 of the buggers :)

lechumbl

07-12-2002, 05:42 PM

Hi all,

Will play a little this weekend and see if I can get sompum' created.

Take care........

WesM63

07-12-2002, 08:20 PM

hey,
Looks good tom.. I like the font gabe used looks neat. I'll see what i can come up with.

lechumbl

07-13-2002, 09:43 PM

Hi all,

A couple of simple ideas for a start.

lechumbl

07-13-2002, 09:48 PM

Maybe this?:

Player0

07-13-2002, 11:52 PM

THat second font is interesting lee, looks like the Lions Tavern font or something.

lechumbl

07-13-2002, 11:57 PM

Hi Tom,

It is called Transylvania.
It was downloaded off the net several years ago.

Take care....

EDIT: The first one is called Nixon.
In his honor for going to China, I guess.

WesM63

07-14-2002, 01:12 AM

ohhhhhhhh me like lee... the second one.

lechumbl

07-14-2002, 01:18 AM

Hi Wes,

I agree, the second one I like best.
But, there are several more people working on ideas, so it will become a more difficult choice as time goes by.

By the time all the ideas are in, the choices will be really hard to make.

Take care..........

WesM63

07-14-2002, 01:24 AM

hey lee,
As i can see we have some skilled artist. I think our logo will be sweet!

Surgeon General

07-14-2002, 04:36 AM

Is it to soon to put in an order for 20 badges?:)

Farabomb

07-14-2002, 02:27 PM

This is my first attempt at photoshop besides croping photos :) I'll revise/redo it when I learn how to use it :p

Farabomb

07-14-2002, 02:28 PM

and I can show it to you when I can figure how to get it up here :mad:

Farabomb

07-14-2002, 02:31 PM

I'll try this

Player0

07-14-2002, 03:54 PM

LOL...i like that slogan :)

I think I might use that somewhere.

WesM63

07-14-2002, 08:16 PM

Hey fara..
thats sweet lol... i think i've seen something like that before... on an A&F shirt lol :D

mdzcpa

07-14-2002, 08:22 PM

LOL...that's funny Fara.:)

You can play a few more off that....

How about:

"Liquid Ninjas -

It's always better when wet"

or

"Liquid Ninjas -
Real Ninjas like it wet"

:D

We can go on for a while with these...heh..heh.:)

Surgeon General

07-17-2002, 10:48 AM

"Liquid Ninjas-

The wetter the better"

lechumbl

07-17-2002, 10:59 AM

Hi all,

Sayings and such are great, but we must remember that it represents Liquid Ninjas to the rest of the world, and we must be careful to maintain a professinal image, if we are to become the top site for O/C, H/W, and S/W help and info.

If we have a saying, it should be of a non borderline nature.

Food for thought..........

Farabomb

07-17-2002, 11:16 AM

I do agree with Lee. Not to say I might throw something like that on some crack and peel and put it on my case :D

Image means a lot unfoutunely. I was not accepted into the honors program in Chubb not because of grades, I exceded the requirements, but at the time I had hair halfway to my arse and was scaring the coperate types running the place. Not only that but they lost one of the best and smartest instructors because of their ways :( When I know we will be having coustomers/vendors in-house at work I wear a shirt and tie and they act totally different to me as oppoused to when I'm wearing my "no, I will not fix your computer shirt" Yet I still act the same. Sometimes you have to play the game so you can do what you want later. :(

WesM63

07-17-2002, 11:22 AM

Hi guys,
I agree also! Image IS everything!

Well in this case atleast.

Player0

07-17-2002, 11:58 AM

Image is everything eh?

You really are Opp's younger cousin ;)

mdzcpa

07-17-2002, 12:32 PM

I agree with Lee about a professional presentation. I thought we were obviously only kidding around with those slogans!:eek:

Farabomb

07-17-2002, 02:49 PM

I ceritanly was kidding around :)

I just can't use photoshop well enough to put something together good :D

MrP

07-17-2002, 04:08 PM

to be honest, i know it sounds corny, but it really does suit us quite well

something like

"Liquid ninjas do it wet"

really does sum us up really, lot of people around here are into water cooling etc, and ok, it has the innuendo to it, but th\ts mu humour anyway :)

its worth thinking about it and comming up with some sort or slogan

toodles :xsofa:

WesM63

07-18-2002, 01:06 AM

Here's what i came up with while tinkering in photoshop. Let me know what you think.

WesM63

07-18-2002, 01:10 AM

Ok i think i deserved begin slapped for that one. I was checking out NM Boards and somehow i ended up With NM instead of LN on my pic.. i'am fixing it now.

WesM63

07-18-2002, 01:12 AM

Ok lets try this.. i like it better anywase.

WesM63

07-18-2002, 01:18 AM

Sorry but better yet.. :D of course the slogan can be whatever we decide on i just had that one stuck in my head..

lechumbl

07-18-2002, 01:22 AM

Hi Wes,

Boy, have you had one too many today?? :D

Just kidding.

Looks good, I like the second from the bottom better than the one with the extra shadowing.

Take care...........

Surgeon General

08-09-2002, 03:53 AM

So what's the deal with the case badges? Is someone taking it for action? Anyone know of a place to order some from? Artwork and such? I am no good at photoshop (hell I can't even get windows to run half the time) but I would like to help in any way I can to see this happen.

mdzcpa

08-09-2002, 08:14 AM

I agree with Surgeon, we need to get moving on this again:)

Gabriel

08-09-2002, 10:14 AM

I will be getting on workin out some more ideas for you all real soon. Been busy tryin to get some websites done, but I really want to give you guys some graphics, if not to use, at least to spark the collective imaginations.

Later daze,
Gabe

Player0

08-09-2002, 12:26 PM

We don't have the money to buy the badges right now. Waiting on some more donations, or perhaps we can sell some of the items we've reviewed.

Farabomb

08-09-2002, 04:14 PM

I may be able to do it at work. I have to see if I can get press time for free. Don't hold me to this but I will try. How many peices are we talking here?

lechumbl

08-09-2002, 04:39 PM

Hi Fara,

We now have 192 members, of course not all willl want case badges.

Also many of us have several systems, so we will need one for each system.

After being in the printing business for many years, I have found that the first one off the press costs a fortune and the rest are virtually free.

Looking at maybe a run of 500.

That is about the best cost break for this small amount.

Take care........

Farabomb

08-09-2002, 04:58 PM

You are so right Lee. I'll be doing all the prep work and depending on how involved I may run the press too. I have to clear it with the boss but that's going to take time. He's away for 2 weeks now but then again we don't have a badge ready yet. If I get it on I'm doing at least a 1000. I just have to figure out how to get that nice domed peice of plastic on them. The finishing is what's going to cost me. I can do just stickers easy. We'll see

Player0

08-09-2002, 05:32 PM

I was going to get 100 of the domed version for $100, when i have that money.

Stickers might work....case badges traditionally have domes...

Farabomb

08-09-2002, 05:35 PM

I want to kick out some stickers for the hell of it I just need the images. If you can get me the highres images I will kick out something and send you some. Also I'll send something for the case badge fund this week.

Synthohol

08-10-2002, 12:26 AM

either the L or the N should have a black headband and or the letters could be made from swords.

just an input....

Farabomb

08-10-2002, 12:37 AM

You have photoshop m8, make something :D

I figured out how to do simple S**t in one weeend :D :D

lechumbl

08-10-2002, 12:58 AM

Hi Synth,

Jump on the PC and make something.
If you have been following this thread, you will see that most of us have put an idea or two here for all to see.
If you have an idea, make it and put it here for us to look at.
Hell, your ideas(s) are just as good as ours.
Soon as we can agree on an image, we can certainly get started.

Take care.....

Surgeon General

08-12-2002, 01:38 AM

Originally posted by Player0
I was going to get 100 of the domed version for $100, when i have that money.

Stickers might work....case badges traditionally have domes...

Hey Player0, I got a suggestion to run by you. I was thinking of now case badges were done once on NM, A couple of members, well one on each side of the pond acted as shipping depots, taking in I am not sure how much per case badge and shipping them to the members. I think I purchased like 10 from Ranger. They only charged money to cover the production and shipping.
Well I have a couple of hundred stampes (and can get more for free ;) ) and I have thousands of envelopes in my garadge (cheaper from costco that way)
If you need to borrow some money to get it started I am willing to help out, or if you want I could front the whole $100 and just get it back from the sales of the badges. I would not charge for shipping since I can get it for free and what would the badges come out to each? just a buck each unless my math is messed up right?
****** NOTICE ****** it is not my intent to make any money off the sale of any case badges that may or may not be produced. Just offering my services to help production happen and take some of the work load off other people.

****** NOTICE #2 ****** in my opinion any profit that may be raised of the sale of the case badges should be turned over to the Top Salad that pays the bills for this little corner of the web because webspace may be cheap but it sure ain't free. I poke around on other peoples sites and see them charging like a $3 average for a case badge and that's not including shipping. Who here would not pay say $1.50 for a LN case badge if it helped suport there fav bbs?

******* NOTICE #3 ******* I am sorry for getting ahead of myself, it's not my place or postition to make any decisions about this type of stuff, just tossing it out there.

Like my ship's motto, I am "Standing by, ready to assist":D

Player0

08-13-2002, 01:16 PM

Thanks SG,

I need to think about that. I wasn't really considering to 'sell' the things, but offering them with any sort of sponsorship, or give them to people doing reviews. I'm not really comfortable with borrowing the money either.

I may offer webhosting to some peoples i know to help get some more money in.

I am interested in maybe just doing the stickers, if we cant get the little dome things. Surely you must beable to buy these things somewhere...?

They are 1" by 1" btw. I also pretty much already have a new site/logo design ready, just need a littlre more time.

kms

08-13-2002, 02:17 PM

i've not read the whole thread but got the jist i think, if someone has a design i'd gladly pay for a 100 LN's with our next batch

kms

08-13-2002, 02:18 PM

p.s dome finish type

lechumbl

08-13-2002, 03:11 PM

Hi Tom,

"They are 1" by 1" btw. I also pretty much already have a new site/logo design ready, just need a littlre more time."

Sure would like to look at all designs and put them up for vote.

Take care........

Player0

08-13-2002, 04:19 PM

Im not sure if Gabe is going to have any more logos. I dont want to change the design too much from what we already use. Ive gotten a bunch of good ideas from this thread.

Once I prepare the final samples, I will set up a vote thread, one for admins/mods, and one for the general public.

Player0

08-13-2002, 04:20 PM

Karl, YGM btw.

lechumbl

08-13-2002, 05:01 PM

Hi Tom,

Kool on the Admins/Mod/Sponsor thread.
The problem is there were a number of good choices, and it is going to be difficult to choose one.
I agree on the case badge looking similar to our existing one tho.

Take care.....

Surgeon General

08-13-2002, 11:02 PM

Hey Player, Just offering my help buddy. The offer stands if you need it. Like Lee said ( I think it was Lee) some of us might need multiple case badges. Back in the day I would put a NM badge on every computer that I would build for friends and such, and all the ones I use at work.
Just wanted to toss another idea out there. If you find a supplier to do a small run and want to pre sell them (if you feel comfortable selling them that is) Just let me know the price. I have no problem waiting to get the goods.
Also if you decide that you don't feel comfortable selling them, just let me know what sponsorship level I need to reach to get oh say, 20 or 30 case badges. Thanks , -wm:D

Gabriel

08-16-2002, 10:36 AM

Hey all,
Just wanted to post a shot of what I have been workin on in 3DS Max. I am actually starting to like it, but I still gotta get the colors right, and add some drips to the sphere. Just wanted to give you all a taste, and get some feedback.
Check it out here
http://www.polarisconcepts.com/LiquidNinjasPostPS.jpg

Let me know what y'all think.

Thanks,
Gabe

Player0

08-16-2002, 11:45 AM

I dont even need to have a vote for this one. It. Looks. Amazingly. Cool.

A few little tweaks and we'll have our casebadge :)

And a new site redesign as well :)

lechumbl

08-16-2002, 12:31 PM

Hi Gabe,

I prefer a little more Oriental, but that is me.

Looks good tho.

Take care....

kms

08-16-2002, 12:43 PM

looks good, my only input would be to add the URL, u never know where these case badges may end up :) & its all good traffic for LN

Surgeon General

08-16-2002, 01:13 PM

Is that for a casebadge? If so what would it look like in a 1 x 1 square?

kms

08-16-2002, 01:16 PM

just

liquidninjas.com

no www or http

will fit fine say across bottom & still be ledgable

kms

08-16-2002, 01:17 PM

about the size of the liquidninjas.com in our seti sigs

kms

08-16-2002, 01:17 PM

depending on your monitor, resolution etc :D

Gabriel

08-16-2002, 01:22 PM

I can add that no problem. Also, the scale down size of 1x1 is no problem either, we tried a test print of it here, and on lower DPI, it still looks pretty tight. Fonts and such are all changeable, just wanted to get some of your opinions.

Thanks,
Gabe

lechumbl

08-16-2002, 01:43 PM

Hi Gabe,

Regardless of what is chosen, we thank you for your effort and time invested in the project. :thumbsup: :beerm8s: :thumbsup:

Take care......

Gabriel

08-16-2002, 01:49 PM

I love doin this stuff anyway. You guys love to tinker around with the hardware, I love to tinker with the software. Somewhere there is a middle ground in there. Any other ideas you guys have for graphics, my skills/hobbies are at your disposal.

Player0

08-16-2002, 01:56 PM

kms has a point. i didnt want to add to much text because it blurs the badge but...ln is too new for people to know the letters alone.

so yeah, lets add liquidninjas.com or www.liquidninjas.com at the top (cause the LN is slightly bottom centered)

im sure that can be done in PS after the render.

WesM63

08-16-2002, 05:10 PM

Hi gabe,
I'am diggin it.. looks good.. I'd put one on my case (s).

Gabriel

08-17-2002, 02:58 PM

I rendered a really large one of the logos I did (1024x768), if anyone wants to use it as wallpaper. You can get it Here (http://www.polarisconcepts.com/liquid1.jpg)

Toodles all,
Gabe

lechumbl

08-18-2002, 06:06 PM

Hi Gabe,

Thanx for making the image available.

Until we come up with a voted final one, I am using this one as my desktop theme.
Looks good on the screen, full size.

Take care.......

mdzcpa

08-18-2002, 08:11 PM

Originally posted by lechumbl
Hi Gabe,

I prefer a little more Oriental, but that is me.

Looks good tho.

Ditto. I would also prefer an oriental look to the letters. Great work so far Gabriel:)

Player0

08-20-2002, 03:29 PM

The oriental look is going away for sure for reasons relating to another site we all know about.

I know Gabe and I are both pretty tired of this project now, and are both very happy with this design, so we aren't going to create any other designs to vote on. Since we've gotten good responses to this badge, I think that it will be our case badge :)

Thx for all the input! :) Ill get with KMS and see if we cant whip these up soon.

lechumbl

08-20-2002, 03:48 PM

Hi all,

There are enough dissenting votes to warrent a vote.

Not everybody wants that design.

Let's open it up.

If I am wrong, it will not be the first time.

Take care.....

MrP

08-20-2002, 04:12 PM

well, what about setting a dead line of a weeks or so's time, and then setting up a new thread with pics of each of the badges and a poll to see what people like.

toodles :xsofa:

P.S. if someone could send me a pic of just the back ground to the current logo i will have a go myself :D

Player0

08-20-2002, 07:50 PM

Lee,

I have no problems with voting, but what exactly are we voting on? Gabe and I have been working on the badges, and this is this is the final version of the badge. It blows the other ones we've worked on away.

If someone else comes up with a professional looking badge design in PSD format at 600dpi CMYK, i will certainly consider it and hold a vote.

I dont expect for everyone to like our design, but thats not possible anyway. The design of the rest of the site needs to be the same as the badge as well. I know that both Gabe and I are happy with this design, and aren't really interested in doing further work on them for a while. We've taken in to account everyones suggestions already.

lechumbl

08-20-2002, 08:12 PM

Hi Tom,

I will send you PM or ICQ when I get home.

This is not the place to discuss it at the moment.

Take care........

WesM63

08-20-2002, 08:19 PM

hi all,
I like the badge in all, but it just dose'nt fit us in my opinion. It would prob look better for them to be more professional looking but at my work our case badges are pretty plain. I'll upload one. We sell thousands of systems each ear and hav'nt changed on bit. No complaints either.

But then it is up to the admins. I just wanted to add my .02

Player0

08-20-2002, 08:27 PM

Well, I get paid to do graphic design, and one of the laws of this type of work is that everyone disagrees with what looks good and what doesn't.

If someone wants to provide additional and professional designs, I will certainly hold a vote. I kind of like the blue and white pointy LN one that Gabe did. But, both of us like this one better.

Farabomb

08-20-2002, 08:54 PM

This is the most pro one we've had yet and I remember earlier in this thread us talking about Image.

Personally, I'm not spouting it's virtues but I don't really care if I love it. I just want to get our name out and it don't matter if it's a picture of a pile of poo with LN.com on top if it. Anything suporting LN will always be welcome on my case.

P.S. I know Tom I'm in printing and everyone has their way and how that like it. That's the downside of being creative. Someone will allways piss in your corn flakes.

mdzcpa

08-20-2002, 08:56 PM

A few comments:

First, it would seem obvious that we all agree that our site design, logo, sig tags, and case badges should be well coordinated. And I gather from Player0's comments that the site design and sig tags will be redesigned around the case badge. Although certainly possible, this sure seems ass-backwards. I would think logo and site design would come first, followed by the case badge design. The fact that we are doing this in reverse is prolly the reason we are getting comments about how well, or not well, the case badge designs "fit" our site. As it sits now, there is almost no correlation whatsoever between the case badge and site logo aside from the orange letters. I'm quite sure that others who are not familiar with our site would never link that case badge design to our site in thier minds. Obviously with a full site and logo redesign this could be corrected, but it would seem you have the tail wagging the dog here.

Second, if we go with such a different design scheme from what we've been using you will be pissing away 4 months of image recognition that have been invested thus far. Not the end of the world mind you, but we would definitely be losing something in a full redesign.

Third, I cannot see any "link" to "the other site" when it comes to oriental letters. Frankly, the "ninja" word itself is the real issue there...that's obvious. Unfortunately, unless you rename the site (and really piss away any site recognition we have) you'll always have the "issue". Without the use of Oriental letters, or some sort of other far east image (like the "other" site has), you lose the whole "ninja" thing too.

Bottom line. It's probably not a good idea to release any images or designs until the whole picture is put together. If you peice meal things, like we've been doing, were never going to get a consistent image...and that is not good. To put out a case badge which looks nothing like what we have in logo, site design, and sig tags at this time would not be a good idea IMOHO. We at least should have a good understanding of where a site redesign would be going. Are we losing the ninja? Are we losing the oriental letters? Blue lines? Color scheme changing?

BTW, if we go with smooth, "modern" looking lettering we will begin to look even more like "the other site".

Player0

08-20-2002, 09:34 PM

I appreciate the thoughtful comments. I appreciate any constructive input. But, I do plan on keeping full control over the graphical content of this website. I do websites 40 hours a week, and I have to listen to opinions and ideas constantly there. Here, I am going to let my own skills out to flex a little.

I haven't just been working on the case badge. Yes, the site will have a new look to it soon, probably after some of the other changes we've been talking about. Aspects of the 3dlogo, especially the font, will be part of the main site eventually. I will handle all the logistics of how the graphics get done, and beleive me, NONE of this is being done peicemeal. Again, I do know what Im doing so have a little faith please. ;)

The current layout was done very peicemeal, because I rushed to get the site in place. But now I have a much better sense of what works and what doesnt. I also realize the importance of the sites visual branding, and will certainly not disrupt that.

By not using the oriental style letters, I think this will deemphasize the Ninja part of the name. I am focusing more on the liquid part, by using a fluid font instead.

The new design will be somewhat cubist yet, but I will definately try to make the style standout and be unique.

I certainly dont mean to poopoo anyones ideas, but I do insist on handling this myself :)

lechumbl

08-20-2002, 09:42 PM

Hi all,

Mike has hit it on the head!
As long as we have "ninja" in the title, we need to have the lettering to match.
When this site was being considered, I mentioned that it was not a good idea to go with anything with the name "ninjas" in it, for obvious reasons, and was ignored. Now it comes back to bite us in the butt.
Gabe has done a fantastic job on the design, and he deserves his dues. Good job Gabe!!
Again I agree, we do not want to have a radical change of our logo and colors, as now people are beginning to recognize us that way.
Granted, case badges are mostly seen by us, in our homes, but it is still good to have a classy and professional badge. And if our badge will match the logo and site design, then we don't have the orange and blue colors in the badge. By the way, the colors are are really great looking,
I am also in agreement that we are far from ready to come up with a finished design.
I was in graphic arts myself for almost 20 years, and changed to PC's, cause it was less stress. Boy is that an untrue statement now.
There are too many people against rushing in and putting together something that "is not us."
Let's step back, cool down, take a deep breath, and work together to resolve this issue. We are too good of a site not to be able to do that. Our people are certainly able to do that.

My .03 cents worth.

Take care........

Player0

08-20-2002, 09:50 PM

We should IM chat tonight about this.

lechumbl

08-20-2002, 09:55 PM

Hi Tom,

Just got home from work, so will eat and ICQ you.

Take care.......

PS..........I assume you meant me?

Player0

08-20-2002, 10:07 PM

Admins in general. Mike and NY are welcome to make suggestions as well. Think of it as a democratic feudal system, I'll listen seriously to everyones suggestions and concerns, but Im not willing to give up the webdesign reigns just at this moment. ;)

But I will address all specific adminal concerns in private.

Gabriel

08-20-2002, 10:09 PM

As I have told you all before, I love doing these graphics, for you guys, for my BladeRunner guys, for my kid, my wife, hell, even my cat. My hobbies are at your disposal, so please let me know what and how you would like it to look, and I will make it look that way. I take alot of pride in the work I do, but that doesn't mean I can't roll with the criticism if it doesn't fit you all. I am a new guy to your group, and glad to be here, I just want to return the favor for all the tech help I get from this site, in any way that I can. Please don't hesitate to tell me your ideas.

Gabe

mdzcpa

08-20-2002, 10:10 PM

First off, I have a lot of faith in you, Tom. I have little, if any, skills in the design area myself, but I have no trouble in trusting your skills.

I also commend Gabriel and Tom for their efforts.:)

Although I cannot do the desgin work myself, I do have plenty of advertising background and I know the importance of name and image recognition and how they interact. In the end I will have no issue going along with whatever works for us, but I will continue to stress the point that the logo and site name must be well coordinated. Having such a strong image invoking word as "ninja" in the site name, without a corresponding visual queue in the logo would be big a glaring mistake. I'm not saying oriental letters is a must. I don't know what the answer is...I am not a designer. But advertising 101 dictates that the logo pay homage to the site name, and that includes the strongest part of the name...ninja.

BTW, none of these comments are made in an upset or uptight manner. I'm totally cool about the situation. I just want everyone to think it through thoroughly.:)

EDIT- Okay taking this off the board now:)

NorthernYankee

08-20-2002, 11:13 PM

Well I guess I should chime in here. I hadn't really commented yet as I am not very good with the creative dessign type of things.

First off thanks for the great designs Gabe they have all looked great, much appreciated.

I honestly really like the design of the case badge. I always wanted the logos and lettering to be more Fluid looking hence the Liquid. And I agree with Tom the site was rushed into existence so things are a bit piecemeal. Nothinng wrong with that, Tom has done a great job with everything in such a limited time.

I think now that originally the badge was going to be like what we have now, but when Gabe came out with such an excellent badge design it got the ball rolling on actually getting the site a makeover. So yes its a bit like the tail wagging the dog but in this case it may actually be a good thing.

I say go with it

--NY

Player0

08-20-2002, 11:40 PM

Well at least NY likes it ;)

Okay fine...we'll be democratic in the light that I dont want anyone yelling at me anymore ;)

See the vote post coming soon.

WesM63

08-20-2002, 11:52 PM

Hi all again,
Sorry tom if you felt like i or we were yelling at you. I agree with what mike was saying. And like i said before.. that badge inparticillary just don't fit us at the moment. Nothing against gabe it's awsome. Maybe we should just wait and see how the site changes go before we go getting in deep.

I like the way the site looks now.. but in all reality i'am not going to leave because of some color/font changes. Now if you go doin stuff like the "other" site did, it may be a tough decsion.